Kushal: Hi there. Welcome to On the Flip Side, a podcast for anyone who wants to live their best sales life. We're going to be talking to buyers, sales managers, SDRs and AEs about things like, what does it take to be a great sales manager, or how can you go home happy month after month? So let's dive right in. 

Hi there. Welcome to On the Flip Side with Wingman. I'm your host Kushal. And today, we're joined by someone who's all about creating partnerships with other companies and people. We're joined by Autumn Carter, who's the Manager of Technology Partnerships at Aircall, a full solution for the modern business. Autumn, so great to have you on the show. 

Autumn: Thanks for having me. I appreciate it. 

Kushal: So, just to sort of kickstart things, what are maybe some of the most unexpected things that you've learned in your career? And if you could maybe just tell us a little bit more about what you do in your own words? 

Autumn: Absolutely, absolutely. So I'm the Manager of Technology Partnerships for North America at Aircall. We have just over 100 integrations in our marketplace. And the majority of those partnerships, with those companies, are managed by either myself or someone who's a part of my team. So what we do is everything from managing the relationship from a technical perspective, you know, kind of being that liaison between an external company and all of the internal stakeholders. And then a big portion of what we do is also demand generation and driving revenue to the organization through our partners. 

Some surprising things that I've learned in my time as a technology partnerships account manager, one thing is that, you know, people are individually motivated, and what might be beneficial to an organization at the macro level might not actually matter very much to an individual person at the micro level. And that's been really helpful for me in identifying, you know, opportunities where even if a partnership could be mutually beneficial for two companies, finding the right people who are motivated by things that I can affect with my work, and who can become kind of champions for Aircall as a partner internal in their organization is critical. Finding those individual people, there's no replacement for it. So yeah, one of the, one of the things that I've learned is just the importance of that. 

Kushal: Thanks for that, Autumn! I think, from what it sounds like is that while it is about technology partnerships, it seems like it's really about managing people and just sort of overall creating those partnerships, maybe over even technology. And from what you described, you know, you talk about demand generation maybe being one of those goals as well, which brings us to sort of something that we were discussing earlier, which is really around partnerships as a role within companies, right? Where does it sit exactly in the whole scheme of how the company operates? Like, who do you report to, who're your stakeholders, what are the decisions that partnerships team makes? I would expect that marketing, customer success, demand generation sales, a lot of folks are involved in this one. What does it look like for you at Aircall and you know, what are maybe some things you recommend around that? 

Autumn: Absolutely, great question. Technology Partnerships, I always say that it's, you really kind of have to be everything and everyone at once. It really is, you know, the kind of role that has to be ready to shift. And you know, what technology partnerships looks like at Aircall will look totally different at another SaaS company, even in another telephony company. What technology partnerships looks like Aircall today is actually different than what it looked like when I joined the organization – the needs are different and the stakeholders are different. So being flexible is I think top priority and very important for folks that are successful in technology partnerships roles. 

In terms of who I report to, it's actually funny thinking back into kind of how the reporting structure has shifted and changed since I joined Aircall. So when I joined back in 2019, I was actually brought in and hired by the VP of Marketing, who's now our CMO, Jeffery. Previous to that, as I was being brought in, they were actually also bringing in a Director of Partnerships, we then later shifted to having a Manager of Partnerships, and then we changed our reporting structure entirely to actually report up directly to revenue leaders, instead of marketing leaders of the organization. So Jeff, and marketing folks aren't in my reporting structure at all. And you know, I think that shift kind of just indicates what has changed at Aircall in the time since you know, I joined the organization, but you know, we are involved with every team you just listed, right. So we work really closely with sales, to drive revenue to work with them and our partners and push deals to the finish line. We work with customer success to prevent churns and talk about churn risks and identify, you know, customers that we might actually be able to help by introducing a partner. We work with the marketing team to make sure that the way that we're talking about Aircall in general is a way that takes into account … we have these very important partnerships and we always like to say now that we're an integration first company, it's something that gets brought up every time we do fundraising or anything like that. That is a number one, you know, one of the most important things about the product and one of the most one of the things we talk a lot about. So working closely across all those teams is really critical to what I do and I do sit in the revenue organization. That's the primary goal that I'm mostly compensated on. But it definitely requires coordination with all of the different teams. 

Kushal: Okay, sorry. I was just having some trouble with the mute button. So really it seems like I said, you're clearly talking to a lot of different stakeholders, you know, talking to a lot of different teams, but having clarity and obviously what that larger metric is that you're sort of aligned with I think that helps a lot of us maybe navigate what could otherwise become messy, prioritization question’s at work. You also talked about, you know, sort of how partnerships can sort of have its own challenges. And my question to you really around this is, you know, what do you think are maybe some of the most misunderstood things today in partnerships? You know, what do you think people get wrong about it? Is it the term itself? Is it what someone on the partnerships team would do? What do some of those things look like?

Autumn: Yeah, absolutely, absolutely, that's a great question. I think, I think some of the things that are misunderstood about technology partnerships is, you know, it goes back to what I was saying before about things being shifting, always shifting and changing. It said no two partnerships look the same, and success for one partnership looks very different than success for another partnership. And I'll get even more specific than that. I think being part of the revenue organization and being in the demand gen role, sometimes the goal is to how can we get more opportunities or introductions from our partners directly to their prospects and customers, or how can we do more co-selling together? And I think those are great, important questions that we definitely have to answer. But they don't automatically mean a good partnership and good relationship. And even if they're not there doesn't mean that the relationship is not good. 

I think we can't lose sight ever, and I think we as partner professionals have to be very, very intentional about making sure that our leadership always remembers that the number one goal of partnerships is to work with our partners to drive more value to our customers, we make customer stickier, we make customers stay longer, they're more likely to scale up and grow with us, when partners are involved. It's just a win-win situation. And one that, you know, we're lucky enough to be in partnerships roles to continue to grow and continue that trend of, you know, increasing that value to customers together. 

So partnerships never ends when there's a closed won opportunity, right. It's about relationship management. It's about you know, if the salesperson that I work with at a partner organization gets an internal question about a mutual customer who's already purchased both our platforms, and they're having issues with the integration or issues with Aircall or something like that, they need to be able to count on me to at least connect them with the right person and help them solve a customer problem. I think a  misunderstood thing, or misunderstood concept about partnerships is that, you know, we're just driving revenue, we're just a demand gen engine. But it really does go a lot further than that. And, as we all know, relationships are never simple, and they're never one way. So I think thinking of partnerships as relationships is helpful in that aspect.

Kushal: Autumn, I think that's a nice way to put it, I think that puts a lot into perspective in terms of what it really takes to do that sort of well. And the fact that it's not just about handing off, you know, a partner, once you know, the paper sort of sign, but really kind of, you know, kind of staying along on that partnership, and really kind of thinking of it for the long term as well. Talking of which, you know, when we're talking about growth, you've also in more recent times become a people manager, you seem to be liking it, what's maybe some of the things you've learned, you know, in this experience? Are you a first time sort of people manager with this size of a team? And if so, what are maybe some of your top tips for other people who have become managers recently on doing a great job of it? 

Autumn: Yeah, yeah, absolutely, that's a great question. Yeah, I wanted to, I really wanted to be a people manager for a long time. So I'm really excited and happy about having that opportunity at Aircall. So I have three direct reports now. Most of those direct reports, so all of them have their own portfolio of partners, kind of generally, around a specific use case or use cases. And that's kind of how they're categorized. And, you know, it's just been incredible to work with the team on partnerships that I've never personally managed partnerships that I have personally manage, it's actually kind of harder to manage to pass on a partnership that I've managed to someone else, because it's really hard to kind of, relinquish that control when you've been doing things one way, but it's, it's so great to see, you know, individuals step into these roles and take the partnership in a new direction, get new eyes on, getting new eyes on a partnership can really bring a lot of value in and of itself. 

So you know, people management for me is about just enabling people to do what they do best, giving them access to, you know, whatever it is that they need that to do a good job and to become as well versed in the partnership and the technology in our processes and our partners processes and all of those things as soon as possible. And as they've gotten ramped up. It's also about just removing roadblocks, right, whether the roadblock is me, you know, maybe asking the wrong questions at a particular moment. I'm very much somebody who believes in constructive criticism and asking the right questions, but one of the things I've had to learn is that, you know, there's a time and a place for asking questions, for reflecting, for having an opportunity to grow and there's also a time and a place to, you know, let them do their thing kind of get out of their way and you know, get on a partner call with them and mute myself and stay on mute and see how they handle it and we'll talk about it after the fact because nothing they can do is going to, you know, ultimately drive a horrible outcome or anything like that. So yeah, relinquishing control has been a big piece of becoming a people manager for me, but it's a really good practice for me. And I think the team has really helped me to grow in that way as well. 

Kushal: So Autumn I understand one of the other things that you will take very seriously is having fun at work and enjoying. How do you really do that? And the other question around that is, so one of the things that I think a lot of folks might be thinking is, you know, what, if we drive a culture of having fun at work, then maybe we won't be taken as seriously, how do you feel about that? 

Autumn: I couldn't disagree more, I almost feel like I'm in a constant competition with my colleagues to see who you know, make the most little slide jokes or, you know, funny comments in an email or in a partner call. I think that, you know, once you start making jokes, and kind of using your sense of humor at work, you'll see, internal and external, you'll see people react in such a positive way, you'll realize that it's actually to your benefit to make people laugh, to have a good time with them. And I definitely think that, you know, having fun at work can only serve to benefit you as an individual and continuing to uphold your motivation. You know, if I had to go into work every day, and kind of not make any jokes, and be very serious the whole day, I know that by the end of the day, I would feel so burnt out. But being able to laugh with the people around me and not taking myself too seriously as well, I think it just comes across in a way that allows people to feel much more trusting of you and can build up a partnership relationship externally that much faster as well. So big fan of it, and I think everyone should, yeah, definitely take advantage of the fact that, you know, we're all having to work and we're all privileged to work and we all can make the most of it and I think that includes using humor. 

Kushal: I couldn't agree more with that piece around, you know, really sort of enjoying the time that we really spend at work, right, because it is a considerable part of our lives, and energies. And I think as people managers, you especially owe it to people, on your team and the folks that you work with, to sort of build that culture for them as well. Autumn, I think I'm just doing a quick time check. I know we're at that 30 minute mark, you have some time to go over?

Autumn: I actually do have a hard stop, I gotta run to an interview.

Kushal: Okay, got it. Okay, so I'm gonna maybe, you know, go to one of our last segments, which is really, since we're all you know about technology, what do you think are maybe you know, the top three inventions in terms of technology for you?

Autumn: Top three inventions in technologies, this could be like anything. Okay, number one, it's sitting here on my desk. I love this. This is actually a gift from a partner. It's this Ember mug, self-regulating temperature mug, that thing is incredible. I'm a very slow coffee drinker, I'm constantly bringing my coffee to the microwave like five times to get it warm again, nothing changed my life. That's definitely the one of the top on the list for me. Well, I have a robot vacuum, pretty obsessed with, it's so nice to… I think you still need to, you know sweep and vacuum spots at times. But it's so nice to sometimes just be able to kind of push a button and have at least the base level of dirt removed from your floor. Incredible, incredible invention, big fan of that one as well. 

Other technology that I think is incredible. Honestly, we don't have much of it in the United States. But I'm very impressed by the strides that have been made in like public transportation elsewhere. I had the privilege of writing not the fastest bullet train, but like one of the high speed trains in Japan a couple years ago. And it was just incredible to like, travel in that way. So quickly across land without being on a plane. I'm not a very good flyer, I don't enjoy it very much. I'm really impressed by that, the high speed train system that they built there. It's really incredible to see. 

Kushal: Thank you so much. Thanks so much Autumn. I think this has been an incredible chat. I know I have many other questions for you. So I'm gonna grab you another time for those. But thank you so much. 

Autumn: Thank you. Thank you Kushal. And yeah, if you do want to grab more time, we can put it on the calendar, I'm happy to check. 

Kushal: Some of the things, the segments that I wanted to go over with you. I think we can also do them async. So you can probably just reply to them when you're able to and I think we should be good. If we need to record something. 

Autumn: Okay, I can just reply, like text, or would you want me to come back with an email?

Kushal: I think just, but if there's something that we plan, I now know the topics that you know, I think he could talk about time that you really enjoy talking about rather. So once I have a think around those, I can definitely set up separate sessions with you. But I just send you questions that you can answer over email in the next few days if that works. 

Autumn: Oh, perfect. That sounds great. 

Kushal: Thanks so much Autumn. Appreciate it. Have a good day ahead. 

Autumn: Thank you so much. Have a good rest of your day. Bye.

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